You Don’t Move Cardi B

“This week I showed the world that I will get the most nasty about mine,” Cardi B tells PAPER matter-of-factly from the other side of the phone. “I never had to get that nasty for my kids. But I did, and I really feel like a lioness. This has been one of the moments I got tested the most about being a parent. But it just goes to show me how strong I am, and it just goes to show me like, Damn, I will really take it to hell for mines: mentally, physically, anything. And I wouldn't care.”

She may sound heated, but the tone of her voice has barely shifted from the start of our chat, as we talk about the success of her second album, Am I the Drama, which has been out for a few weeks via Atlantic Records. The 23-track collection debuted at No. 1 on Billboard 200 and reached double platinum status just 10 days after its release — though that didn’t mean avoiding “drama” around the numbers. More on that later.

It’s been nearly seven years since the Bronx-born rapper released her history-making debut Invasion of Privacy in 2018, getting her first taste of multi-platinum sales and becoming the first solo female artist to win the Best Rap Album Grammy. Her breakout single, 2017’s “Bodak Yellow,” was the first solo No. 1 by a female rapper in nearly two decades. She released culturally seismic hits like 2020’s “WAP” featuring Megan Thee Stallion and 2021’s “Up” (which both feature on Drama) and became a household name, going from niche online celeb and cast member on VH1’s Love & Hip Hop: New York to global brand and fashion icon. Still, even as she continues to sit pretty on top of the charts, prepare for her first headline tour, and carry her fourth child and first baby with New England Patriots wide receiver Stefon Diggs, she hasn’t been able to avoid… well, the drama.

In the weeks before our interview, Cardi and Nicki Minaj sparred publicly on X. It wasn’t the first time the rappers expressed their respective beefs with one another, but this back-and-forth was particularly heated. It started with a now-deleted tweet from Minaj that read “$4.99” which fans took as a jab at the promotional pricing of Am I the Drama? on iTunes, and a dig that the low prices were leading to an inflation of album sales numbers. Minaj then shared a number of now-deleted tweets that used the same “A-B-C-D-E-F-G” lyrics featured in the Drama track “Magnet” (i.e. “Abcdefgeeeee Falling off the charts with a big bellyyyy.”) When Cardi responded, the sparring shifted to take-downs of romantic partners, memes about looks and the aforementioned tweets about kids.

Rapper JT — who Cardi seemingly dedicates an entire verse of her diss track “Magnet” to — also took part in the X feud, tweeting: “Lol that bitch home ugly & mad no celebration! I would’ve been break dancing right now if I was #1 but she know she lied!!!!!” (More on that dance move later.) Still, for Cardi’s part, she expected at least some of the reaction she received from her new album, though she felt like her responses — which includes a now viral call out of the rapper Bia in her song “Pretty & Petty” where she taunts “Name five BIA songs, gun pointin' to your head/ Baow, I'm dead” — were more than warranted. “Why would you think I'm the one to be fucked with?” she tells PAPER.

Notable diss tracks aside, Am I the Drama? paints a bigger picture of Belcalis Marlenis Almánzar, one that shares the full emotional range of the rap mogul. On “Safe,” she talks about finally feeling protected in a relationship. In “Man Of Your Word,” she reflects on her tumultuous dynamic with the father of three of her children, rapper Offset, acknowledging, “I really hope you find love, I hope you find a good spirit/ I hope she satisfy your needs and everything that I didn't.” And, despite conflicts with some of her contemporaries, Drama is brimming with features and cosigns from other artists across genres like Summer Walker, Selena Gomez, Kehlani, Dougie F, Lizzo, Cash Cobain, Lourdiz, Janet Jackson, Tyla and Latto (who appears on the album’s bonus version). It’s still the raw, in-your-face Cardi flows fans expect, now with fresh perspective gleaned over the past seven years. “I grew so much. I had a couple of kids. Now, I’m really in the industry,” she tells us of the gap between her albums. “I was navigating it. I was understanding it. I was learning it. I was learning myself.”

Though the social media ‘drama’ may seem like a distraction, don’t get it twisted. Much like the lyrics in her track “Better Than You” insinuate — “Pretty hoes do what they want/ Ooh, that's the law of attraction” — Cardi’s focused on what she wants to create next. “I think people really underestimate how smart I am, or how much input I have on everything that I do,” she tells us. “I really am the chess piece to what I do. People don't understand, like, How the fuck she did this, how the fuck she did that? It's just my mind.”

This interview has been edited and condensed.

I was at your album release party and noticed how emotional you got when you first came on stage. What about that moment brought you to tears?

I was really emotional because I was very proud of myself. It wasn't even just because I was putting the album out, it's because I have worked so hard these past two months, nonstop, and I've been doing it all while I'm carrying [a baby], and all those thoughts just came to my head. Like, Wow, the album is about to come out, and I worked my ass off. I just feel like nobody really understands when you say, you working your ass off, and you see the results. You see the love. You feeling the energy of your hard work.

Invasion of Privacy came out almost seven years ago and you’ve talked in recent interviews about how much your approach has shifted from then to now even how you’ve changed emotionally. What do you think the biggest difference between this Cardi and that Cardi is?

When I put out my first album, people have to remember I didn't even understand what the big deal was [about] putting out an album. I thought putting out an album was like, Okay, you just got to put out a project. This one, I understood how serious it was, and I wanted it to be something that I love. All these songs I personally love. All these songs, these are the songs I picked from out of a selection. When I did Invasion of Privacy, I didn't have a selection. I was rushing to get it out the way, because I know I had to do music videos and I was going to give birth to Kulture. This time, I took my time. Not only that, but in the past seven years, I grew so much. I had a couple of kids. Now, I’m really in the industry. I was navigating it. I was understanding it. I was learning it. I was learning myself. I was growing up. I became an adult, a real adult, a real grown-up. Got my first properties. I was married. We went through COVID. We understood the value of family. We understood the value of yourself. A lot has happened in the past seven years.

Now that the album is out, you’ve clearly been successful on the charts. How are you feeling about the fan reaction, though? Not just the numbers, but the memes, the TikTok videos — are you seeing all of those?

That’s what makes me so proud of myself. It's been such a drama with the numbers. First of all, I'm very proud of my number. Very proud of my number. We're in a very different era when it comes to music. So not only am I proud of my numbers, but you got bitches from the sideline that are going to try to make you not feel proud of your numbers. There's people that have never even seen 100,000 sales calling me a flop. So people will try to discourage you about your numbers, but clearly, they don't discourage me. That's what people will try to do, but it fails. It fails when 1000s of videos are being made to your music. And then there's 1000s of people doing memes to your songs. There's so many people that was doubting my album, that is like, “You know what, her album is good?”

People had been waiting for seven years for a new Cardi album. How did you make the decision on who you wanted to be a part of that? How did you go about making the decision on who would be featured?

It was funny, because I have asked different people to do different songs. Some songs I didn't even put on there. Some, I went with whoever sounded the best on the songs, to be honest with you, because there's some people that I asked, and it's not that they didn't sound beautiful, it just didn't fit the feeling of the song. So everybody that's on the album feels the feelings of the song. And then there were people there I did ask to be featured on my album, and they were being funny. Because those are the people … I'm not the type of person to ask people for shit ... but these are the people they always be like, “Oh, I want to work with you. I want to work with you. I want to work with you!” And then when I give them my opportunity, they just want to act funny, but trust me, they regret that shit.

Right. Now you know when they ask, they don't really mean it.

You don't got to tell me that you want to work with me, or your managers don't have to hit me up saying you want to work with me. For what? I ain’t reaching out to you.

I was gonna ask about your track “Magnet,” on the topic of people being fake. As you continue to grow in celebrity and not only that, have to protect yourself, your career, your family as well, how do you navigate that? How do you deal with people being fake with you?

When it comes to the song "Magnet," it was a clear thing. People think I'm very confrontational because I do confront my conflicts. But there have been times that I have ignored people, and I feel like when I ignore them, I keep getting tried. Last year, when I felt tried, I was like, Hold on. I feel like bitches is trying me because maybe I'm just not where they think I should be in my career, or maybe because they think that I'm not gonna get in the paint with them when it comes to this rapping shit, or in real life shit. And it's like, Bitch, it could get like that. It could get like that with me when it comes to music, when it goes to Twitter, when it comes to real life, like I could get like that.

That was just an example. And it's crazy, because when I do it in a song, it causes such a frenzy. It's like Oh, you thought, you thought that I was ignoring you because I was being a good person and a goody goody. I was ignoring you until I couldn't take it anymore, and I had to show you that I am not the fucking one. And let me tell you something. When a girl is being funny towards me, when it comes to music, when it comes to anything, I will respond to you when I feel like it. I feel like people just be thinking that you supposed to get up and just run and write … Bitch, you don't move me. You don't move my thoughts, and you don't move my fucking day. Think I'm just gonna run to the studio to reply to a nobody? No, I'm gonna do it on my time and when it benefits me and how I like to, that's what “Magnet” is about. Now everybody mad at “Magnet.” Why would you think that I'm the one to be fucked with?

I wanted to ask about “Safe.” I feel like people like to focus on one side of the coin when it comes to your creativity and what you're putting out there. But this song was really vulnerable. What made you decide to share this with your fans on this album?

I went from a marriage to being single to then dating and that's just what you want from somebody. You want somebody that makes you feel safe. Not just safe physically. I don't like putting my partners in danger, or in no type of way I like to handle my own smoke, but feeling safe is somebody you feel like you could talk to and things are going to be okay, and that's gonna always have my back or is gonna tell me about myself. I mean, which girl do not want to feel like that song? You know what I'm saying? I know you do. I know I do. I want somebody to make me feel safe. I want somebody to make me feel special.

Do you feel like that's how you feel now, or do you feel like it's more so a way of almost manifesting that sort of relationship into your life?

At that moment. That's how I felt.

In “Salute” you talk about real bitches. What defines a ‘real bitch’ to you?

I just feel like it's a bitch that is like … like ... Me. [Laughs]. I’m like every type of real bitch that there is, because I'm not gonna even play your face. I'm not the type of person. I will never cross you. I will never cross you for money. I will never cross my friends for a man, I will never cross nobody. We all talk a little bit about each other all the time, so that's nothing, but I will never insult my friends. That's what makes you a real bitch. Not just money, because there's a lot of bitches that got money. They are just fake as fuck. Fraud as fuck. They're not who the fuck they say they are. So I can't be like, Oh, saluting a real bitch is a hustler. No. That doesn't make you a real bitch. A real bitch is a bitch that will not cross you, their friends, or anybody. Like somebody to speak highly about you in a room that you're not in.

Even this week, I'm not even gonna say a bitch, but there has been somebody I had to go to, I had to address, I had to call, because I felt like, Damn, I have shown you so much love so many times, and I genuinely like you, and you let somebody disrespect me right in front of your face? It's like, Damn, how you gonna do me like that when I fuck with you heavy? Some people probably just don't know when I show them genuine love. If I'm even around you, if I'm spending my time with you, or if I want to do anything that got anything involved with you, that means I genuinely like you. And if you let somebody try to play me in your face and you just there, like, looking fucking stupid or egging it on, it’s like, Wow, you was never a real bitch, and I can't fuck with you. Like, Wow, that's the sort of person you are. I hate feeling jaded from people that I genuinely like. I hate that.

Right. You’re not asking people to do anything more than what you're doing for them.

Just be real because I'm a real ass person.

Speaking of the drama, do you feel like it fuels you and your creativity? Motivates you? Or at this point, do you feel like it exhausts you?

I be every kind of tired and it exhausts me. There's drama that I expected to come. Because if I'm throwing shots at bitches, I expect the drama to come from them. I'm not gonna act like, Oh, it wasn't gonna come when I'm directly talking to you. I can't be surprised that a bitch is trying me, because I pull their cards. However, when people just be trying you, and you're not even paying attention to them, you're not even talking to them about them, it's like, This is why I say that I am the drama. I even bother bitches when I don't even give them attention. It's still an issue. So that just means that is that. I am the drama. No matter how much I avoid it is gonna come to me. It's gonna come to me even with the stupidest stuff. Even with the court shit. Look how it always falls on my lap, honey. One way or another, it just don't fucking stop.

You've just put out an album, you've got a tour coming up. Where are you at, emotionally and mentally, when it comes to doing all of this while being a mom in general, but also, getting ready to become a mom again?

I'm just letting time flow right now. It’s my fourth kid, so I’m already used to it. But I feel like, definitely this week, my mother warrior came out. I was fighting for my kids. This week I showed the world that I will get the most nasty about mine, and it was, it felt so weird, because I never had to get that nasty for my kids. But I did, and I really feel like a lioness.This has been one of the moments I got tested the most about being a parent. But it just goes to show me how strong I am, and it just goes to show me that it's like, damn, I will really take it to hell for mines: mentally, physically, anything. And I wouldn't care.

You’ve talked about growing up around hard work and sacrifice, which shaped your own drive and work ethic. What do you hope your kids take from that? Do you want them to have the same work ethic, or do you hope they can relax a bit more because of the success you’ve already built?

You really have to be born with it, because you could be in a household where you see both your parents or a parent, or you see a single mother working their ass off, and yet you still wouldn't have that drive. You could grow up in poverty, or you could grow up in a very wealthy family; if you don't have it in you, you just don't have it in you. It's almost like you have to hope that your kids have that work ethic in them, and I just pray that they do. It's gonna be a lot of prayers, because it's for them. I don't want one of them to feel they're behind their siblings. You just got to work and not think too much … just get out there and get in the paint and do it. Procrastination is what kills you. It’s what slows you. Don't ask too much questions. Just go and fucking do it.